Talk:Lord Speaker

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Old discussions

My fault for not spotting this article yesterday, otherwise I would have moved it rather than creating a parallel article at Speaker of the House of Lords. Which article should be merged into the other? Schedule 6 of the Constitutional Reform Act 2005 uses the term Speaker of the House of Lords not Lord Speaker. However, I see this page uses both terms, and there is some discussion in this PDF. The discussion in this Hansard extract is also fascinating. -- ALoan (Talk) 14:09, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I agree that the two articles should be merged, possibly this one redirecting to the Speaker of the House of Lords one. But the Speaker will be called the "Lord Speaker" in the same way as it's "Mister Speaker" in the Commons. But we'll find out in the next Parliament what's really going to happen! David

Merge can now take place

The Speaker of the House of Lords article should now be redirected automatically to this article. David.

bizzare title

Surely when the merge was made the wrong title was chosen? I presume that just as the "speaker of the house of commons" is referred to as "Mr/Madam Speaker" so likewise will the "speaker of the house of lords" (or perhaps "lord speaker of the house of lords") only be referred to as "the lord speaker." Shouldn't this article's title be analagous to Speaker of the House of Commons, and refer to the office's actual name, not the familiarized form? Doops 20:48, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Lo and behold, many months later — no comments? Doops | talk 17:44, 29 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

We shouldn't do anything until the Lord High Chancellor himself decides to actually change the rules of the House of Lords and remove his office from being automatically the Lord Speaker. When that will happen, I do not know... David 19:29, 29 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

title again

I repeat my earlier objection: shouldn't this page be at Lord Speaker of the House of Lords (or possibly just Speaker of the House of Lords)? Surely "Lord Speaker" will just be his form of address and the moniker he's known by in the house itself; but that doesn't make it a suitable title for an article. cf Mister Speaker and Speaker of the House of Commons. Doops | talk 16:26, 3 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

While there is more than one "Speaker" around the world, I think we're going to have the only "Lord Speaker". David 18:37, 3 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Here we go!!

The position of Lord Speaker is about to become a reality - BBC News - Lord Speaker David 19:24, 4 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Information can be found here:

Please see the following PDF document for the official information about the role and office of Lord Speaker.

[1]

David 19:03, 6 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Lady Speaker?

Is a woman holding the office of 'Lord Speaker' to be refered to as 'Lady Speaker'? Or does it stay Lord Speaker (like Lord Mayor)? (Alphaboi867 06:05, 13 July 2006 (UTC))[reply]

Order of precedence

Has the Lord Speaker been officially added to the United Kingdom order of precedence? Surely such an office would end up being quite high up the order, at least being about the same as the Speaker of the Commons? David 18:10, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Move

This really, definitely, certainly does not belong at this title. This point has been raised several times above but no one has moved the article. We don't have the Commons Speaker at Mister Speaker. This should be moved to Speaker of the House of Lords, so can someone do it now please? 86.136.0.145 22:39, 31 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, the common usage does seem to be "Lord Speaker", whatever the Act says. As an additional datapoint, the relevant page at the Parliament website, [2], uses "Speaker of the House of Lords" as a heading and then uses "Lord Speaker" on every other occasion, even when comparing the Lord Speaker and the Speaker of the House of Commons. -- ALoan (Talk) 22:46, 31 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The position is this:

The Standing Orders referred to a "Speaker of the House", and provided that "It is the duty of the Lord Chancellor ordinarily to attend the Lords House of Parliament as Speaker of the House; and in case the Lord Chancellor be absent, his place on the Woolsack may be taken either by a Deputy Speaker, authorised under the Great Seal from the Queen to supply that place, or by a Deputy Chairman, appointed by the House; and if neither a Deputy Speaker nor a Deputy Chairman be present, the Lords may then choose their own Speaker during that vacancy". The term Lord Speaker was previously used in some standing orders to refer to the Lord Chancellor or other Speaker of the House pro tempore.
The Act has simply replaced the words "Lord Chancellor" in various Acts of Parliament with the words "Speaker of the House of Lords". It was not known at the time what provisions the Lords would make for the speakership of the House.
The Committee reported ' “Lord Speaker” is the existing title. It is the title used in the Standing Orders and the Companion. It is the title used in the Constitutional Reform Act 2005. Baroness Boothroyd and Lord Weatherill have confirmed their view that it is the appropriate title, and should not lead to any confusion.'
The House of Lords have now amended Standing Order 18 to read "It is the duty of the Lord Speaker ordinarily to attend the Lords House of Parliament as Speaker of the House; and in case the Lord Speaker be absent, his place on the Woolsack or in the Chair may be taken either by a Deputy Speaker, authorised under the Great Seal from the Queen to supply that place, or by a Deputy Chairman, appointed by the House; and if neither a Deputy Speaker nor a Deputy Chairman be present, the Lords may then choose their own Speaker during that vacancy", and provided a new standing order 18A for the first and subsequent elections of the Lord Speaker. The old standing orders which referred to the Lord Speaker are untouched.
So, there is a position of "Speaker of the House (of Lords)" or "Lord Speaker" (in the older standing orders) which includes both the principal office holder and his deputies. There is also a "Lord Speaker" who is a single person parachuted into the standing orders to replace the Lord Chancellor, who ordinarily but not always acts as Speaker of the House (or Lord Speaker). So the Lord Speaker is not always the Lord Speaker. Confusing, isn't it? I'm not sure the Lords considered the possibility of referential failures like this when they drafted the new amendments.
We have to decide whether this article is about the speakership of the House of Lords or the individual office of Lord Speaker, i.e. do we include Deputy Speakers and Deputy Chairmen in this article? Andrew Yong 01:23, 1 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Good stuff. So "Lord Speaker" could refer to Baroness Hayman (as the holder of the principal office), or Baroness Hayman and her deputies (as the person on the Woolsack actually exercising the office)?

As a point of fact, the Constitutional Reform Act 2005 does not include the term "Lord Speaker" - Section 18 and Schedule 6 are entitled "Speakership of the House of Lords",[3][4], and Schedule 6 substitutes the term "Speaker of the House of Lords" in various other statutes. -- ALoan (Talk) 10:00, 1 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, thanks for the research, you've set out a good case. I can see now that it would be better to wait until usage is established in this area, once people have had time to get used to the new arrangements. 86.136.0.145 12:17, 1 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

State Opening of Parliament

"The Lord Speaker will assume most of the duties that the Lord Chancellor used to have in relation to his Parliamentary role, including ceremonial duties such as the State Opening of Parliament."

Now that there has been a State Opening of Parliament since the first Lord Speaker was elected, what role did she play at the event? I'm pretty sure the Lord Chancellor handed the Queen the Speach. I didn't really see the Lord Speaker at all. David 21:34, 15 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

role

There is plenty on what she does not do (call the house to order, rule on procedure) but very little on what she does. Is the article lacking or does she actually have very little to do. Elsewhere it is suggested that she doesn't even do much at the opening.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.206.112.162 (talk) 14:39, 20 April 2007

Interregnum

I think there was also a Lord Speaker for a limited period during the Interregnum. Could this be clarified, and if so added. PatGallacher (talk) 01:44, 5 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Next election ?

I heard that the speaker is elected in an early period of a new parliament, but the term limit is 5 years. When is the next election, soon (because of the general eletion) or in the summer of 2011 ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.6.3.134 (talk) 07:17, 31 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Older references to the post - 17th century

There is a reference in Sir Robert Atkyns to his holding the post of 'Speaker of the House of Lords' at the end of the 17th century. Therefore the office has been existed in the past. Ender's Shadow Snr (talk) 22:52, 8 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Prior to 2006 the role of Speaker in the House of Lords fell to the Lord Chancellor. From 1689 to 1693 the office of Lord Chancellor was placed in commission (meaning that the duties of the office were shared between a group of individuals known as "Lords Commissioners of the Great Seal"). Atkyns was given the role of Speaker during that time. Road Wizard (talk) 23:07, 9 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Brilliant - thanks for the clarification; makes a lot of sense. Could make for an absurdly hard pub quiz question.... Ender's Shadow Snr (talk) 12:15, 10 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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Lord Chancellors

Someone has gone back and added LC's as 'Lord Speaker' in an unknown number f articles. see William_Murray,_1st_Earl_of_Mansfield under political offices. This needs stopping if people see it. The LC presided but was not LS Garlicplanting (talk) 13:36, 9 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]